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Florida’s “Shoot First” Law Critiqued by Gun Control Lobby Following Trayvon Martin Shooting
Democracy Now / Video Report
Published: Wednesday 21 March 2012
“Stand Your Ground Law” brings scrutiny to Florida’s “shoot first” ask questions later law.
We speak with Caroline Brewer of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence about how the killing of Trayvon Martin has brought renewed scrutiny to Florida's controversial "Stand Your Ground" law, also referred to by critics as the "shoot first" law. Backed by the National Rifle Association, the law expands the right of citizens to claim self-defense in the killing of others. More than 20 states have similar measures in place. Martin says the law allowed Floridians with criminal backgrounds — including many who plead guilty to assault, burglaries and child molestation — to obtain concealed carry licenses. "You're talking about people who are dangerous, people who are violent, and yet just within a short time after the law was passed, Florida had hundreds and hundreds of these people with these licenses to go out and kill somebody else," Brewer says. "And pretty much it was their word against the other person's."
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ABOUT Amy Goodman
Amy Goodman is the host of "Democracy Now!," a daily international TV/radio news hour airing on more than 900 stations in North America. She is the author of "Breaking the Sound Barrier," recently released in paperback and now a New York Times best-seller.
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By Kiley Kroh
19 comments on "Florida’s “Shoot First” Law Critiqued by Gun Control Lobby Following Trayvon Martin Shooting"
March 22, 2012 3:20pm
@LIVEMIKE
Then how do you explain this:
Your "statistic" is anything but factual. Consider this report from the Florida Department of Law Enforcement:
http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/Content/getdoc/24ea7a92-ce2b-4624-bced-15bb3...
2010-2011
Murder: -03.1%
Violent Sex Offenses: +1.1%
Robbery: -4.3%
Aggravated Assault: -3.4%
Now under Domestic Violence, under the rubric of manslaughter only, the % change is -36.4 (from a total of 11 in 2010 to 7 in 2011) .
This is hardly attributable to Concealed Weapons permits unless we are to believe that family members who are now carrying guns have reduced domestic manslaughter from 11 in 2010 to 7 in 2011.
Also, since the number is so low in comparison to total population, it is statistically insignificant. Consider that if there were 1 manslaughter statistic in 2010 and none in 2011, we could say there was a 100% drop in that sort of crime, which sounds impressive. Statistically, it is irrelevant.
This would make a good example of misrepresentation of statistical data in a college 101 logic course.
BTW, I'm not a gun control fanatic either. But, you really should come down off of your emotional roller coaster long enough to look at real facts such as those from Florida Department of Law Enforcement.
March 22, 2012 6:35am
the lack of forensic evidence - the inability/unwillingness of the police to investigate as a potential crime - that is the 2nd most vile fact of this case. the gun nuts will always be willing to kill. I hope Trayvon's family sues the community into the next century. It looks like they have a case.
March 22, 2012 6:04am
"But a loophole in Florida law allows people charged with felonies to obtain licenses to carry guns three years after they complete their sentences so long as a judge "withholds adjudication."
In a sort of legal no man's land, the defendants plead guilty or no contest. They serve probation, complete community service, obtain counseling, pay fines or fulfill other requirements. When they successfully complete the terms, they have no criminal record.
The break often is given to first- or second-time offenders in instances in which the state's case is weak, and a plea deal appears to be the best option for defendants without the money to mount a strong defense, legal experts said. But it also has aided people accused of violent felonies, sometimes repeatedly."
So basically the judge decides not to take away their gun rights, even if they "accused repeatedly" (which means that they're found not guilty repeatedly I guess). It sounds to me like this deal is given when the prosecution has an extremely weak case. In fact it's probably the only reason that a lot of people cop a plea ("plead and you'll at least be able to get your guns back some day"). Perhaps the real scandal is how many innocent people (mainly black I suspect) are being coerced into a plea deals by corrupt prosectors. Of course the illegitimate use of plea deals is yet another cause the left is big on, until it conflicts with their gun control ideology, then they just fink out.
March 22, 2012 5:48am
You know gun control proponents are scum. They don't care if innocent people die, in fact they ignore the facts to push their agenda so that the REAL causes aren't dealt with. The REAL cause is the complete lack of police concern with someone killing a black man. That a black man let alone the NAACP would ignore this to push a gun control agenda just shows how little they care about each other. For god's sake if you're not going to be concerned about people of your own colour being killed stop calling each other "brother". It's of course Ok to care or not care regardless of race, but stop pretending you do.
March 22, 2012 5:42am
It's amazing how the gun control crowd get basic facts wrong pretty much as soon as they can. People ALWAYS had a right to use weapons to defend themselves if they reasonably believed they were in danger. The "Stand your ground" legislation simply said they didn't have to run away first, which they only ever had to do if it could be done safely reversed the burden of proof. The latter is bad, the former not so much.
The CCW law did not allow felons to carry weapons, every law of this kind passed in any state put felons on the list of types of people that were denied CCW permits. Every one of these laws allows the state to give reasons why they denied a permit. The fact that the State didn't do this suggests that either it's the problem with the beuracrats not the law or the case against these "felons" wasn't all that good to begin with. People who plead guilty were AUTOMATICALLY disqualified. Get your facts straight, Nation of Change. CCW holders are the most peaceful people in florida.
March 22, 2012 5:26am
Judging crime rates on the basis of what you see on the news is stupid. There is ZERO evidence of the relationship you claim, the more guns are legally carried the less crime there is, this is what the actual scientific research says. Calling a law insane doesn't make it so, back up your argument. It is people like you, that for DECADES ignored negative effects on safety gun control laws have that show contempt, not the legislature that finally got it right.
March 22, 2012 4:27am
"Kill at will." Let's debate that new and odd legislation rife in our country. Confucius, Mencius, Lao Tzu, and Chuang Tzu will be convening a symposium in Florida to attempt sane, benevolent, loving behavior based on reciprocity and propriety. Attending will be the Sanford police department, Florida state legislature, general population, NRA, and worried southerners who fear the racial future of their state.
These Chinese sages will appear free of fee and speak calmly and considerately to the assembled.
How do you think it will go?
March 21, 2012 8:39pm
So crime is down? Then why does the Orlando nightly news have nonstop stabbings, shootings, missing persons, robberies? You can't even watch it. The NRA runs the Florida GOP-run Legislature, it's a known fact! Gun shows all over the state where ANYONE can buy a gun, no questions asked. Open carry law, insane. The more handguns that get into the hands of FL citizens (and elsewhere) the more shootings and murders and crimes committed with a gun. It's a culture of violence, and innocent people are the losers in this! Shame on Jeb Bush, the bought-and-paid for Legislature for their contempt for our safety.
March 21, 2012 5:39pm
Violent crime is down everywhere.
March 21, 2012 7:03pm
Actually, Florida is ranked #4 in the number of violent crimes per 100,000 people.
Crime peaked in the 1990's and is down to about mid-1970's levels.
Some have attributed the fall in crime rates to better family planning (access to contraceptives and abortion services), the theory (and correlation) being that children are better educated and cared for, and less likely to turn to crime to survive.
On the other hand, crime has gone down over all (including Canada), regardless of the gun laws of any particular place.
March 21, 2012 4:19pm
. . . Amy Goodman . . .
Thank you for reporting this story??? I would like to say it is a good "story" - BUT it isn't over yet . . . . and only time will tell how long it takes . . . . . a well known fact often censored, fact -.-is that the law.... is an ass . . . administered by the same
March 21, 2012 4:15pm
I totally agree . . . Zimmerman was clearly the aggressor here.
March 21, 2012 4:36pm
This law should be renamed, ‘Last Man Standing”. Whoever is left alive can claim self defense, even if there is an aggressive stalker who disobeyed police instructions to keep away.
Unfortunately, Trayvon, even though innocent when he left the house, committed several sins: he left his residence while Black, he left his residence unarmed, he let his teachers’ praise - “…he majored in cheerfulness..” go to his head thus blinding him to the reality he has to walk in, he put on a hoodie instead of carrying a fringed yellow umbrella and his father did not remind him to put on the symbolic shackles hanging at the door when Trayvon went out. So, with all these sins poor Trayvon forgot, it was just his time to go. On the other hand by default, Zimmerman wins the self defense pot because he was the last man standing. Trayvon was not.
If you can’t understand this logic, there is something wrong with you.
March 21, 2012 3:50pm
Well, Amy, have you checked to see how many Floridians with Concealed Weapons Permits have committed homicide? Or what the homicide rate in Florida has been since the "Stand Your Ground" law was enacted in 2005?
Violent crime is down significantly (by 30% last year). And blacks as well as whites benefited from that.
March 21, 2012 7:09pm
Actually, if you look at the statistics you'll see that most crime went up for a few years after the 2005 law. (http://www.disastercenter.com/crime/flcrime.htm)
If you look at the numbers, almost all crimes rose until about 2007, then started falling. Most are still above 2005 levels. The "index" is way down, but it's skewed by the high number of property thefts.
March 21, 2012 5:55pm
Your "statistic" is anything but factual. Consider this report from the Florida Department of Law Enforcement:
http://www.fdle.state.fl.us/Content/getdoc/24ea7a92-ce2b-4624-bced-15bb3...
2010-2011
Murder: -03.1%
Violent Sex Offenses: +1.1%
Robbery: -4.3%
Aggravated Assault: -3.4%
Now under Domestic Violence, under the rubric of manslaughter only, the % change is -36.4 (from a total of 11 in 2010 to 7 in 2011) .
This is hardly attributable to Concealed Weapons permits unless we are to believe that family members who are now carrying guns have reduced domestic manslaughter from 11 in 2010 to 7 in 2011.
Also, since the number is so low in comparison to total population, it is statistically insignificant. Consider that if there were 1 manslaughter statistic in 2010 and none in 2011, we could say there was a 100% drop in that sort of crime, which sounds impressive. Statistically, it is irrelevant.
This would make a good example of misrepresentation of statistical data in a college 101 logic course.
March 21, 2012 4:14pm
Excuse me . . . are you attempting to say because 99 % of the people are good the other 1% isn't bad ???
. . I always liked the story of the armed bandit that walked into the bar and announced a hold-up[ . . . . looked around, saw it was a cop hang-out put down his gun laid down and surrendered....
......DOES THAT HAVE ANYHTING TO DO WITH YOUR STORY ???
. . . JUSTIFIED HOMICIDE ?? maybe the cops in the bar should have left a grease stain on the floor ????
. . . . . JUSTIFIED ?.? KILLING AN UN-ARMED PERSON ??? OH I THOUGHT HE WAS DANGEROUS - - OH I THOUGHT HE WAS UP TO NO GOOD ????
SELF DEFENSE - IS NOT KILLING AN UN-ARMED PERSON - MAN - WOMAN - CHILD - TEENAGER . . . . . .
March 21, 2012 1:50pm
The guy was black! He was clearly a threat. Mesicans too.
I kid.
But that is how many of these gun happy creeps think.
Zimmerman should be tried, convicted and spend most of his remaining life in prison.
March 21, 2012 1:18pm
Zimmerman was clearly the aggressor here. The 9-11 calls where he was told to back off, and the others where Trayvon was yelling for help prove this! I feel for Trayvon's mom, she, her family and the rest of us have lost a good kid to senseless bigotry. This case is a prime example that this Stand your ground law must be repealed. My latest cartoon is about this miserable law.http:// www.whatnowtoons.comLeft of Center Independent Political Cartoons